Did you see those kids fighting? It kinda made the battle at the Stepstones look like a joke. Anyway, Chris, Jim, and Kent are back to break down the episode and answer all the important questions nobody else cares to ask. Seriously, would you rather cut your lip or your palm? Anything written in BOLD is written by Kent to respond to the guys. We have a companion podcast called Kenter At Your Own Risk where Chris and I go more in-depth on this week’s episode.
I gotta tell you all something fun to do. Pull up Lil Jon’s “Outta Your Mind” the explicit version. Then on HBO Max, get to about 34 minutes. Mute the episode. At 34:12, press play on the song. Just trust me. I am sure that you could probably sync it up better, but I had so much fun watching this 3 times this way. This is not something stolen off of the internet, just an original Kent idea. You’re welcome.
1. Who got the worst of it between the 6 children in their fight? You can include just the fight or the aftermath.
Chris: Aegon, since he got woken up from a hangover to have his dad call him out in front of everybody, and he missed out on the actual fighting. (I feel like he’s an inexperienced drinker, so I magnify that hangover substantially.)
Jim: I would say that Rhaenyra’s boys got the worst of the fight. Otto had a powerful line that “Aemond gained more out of the deal by gaining Vhagar than he gave up (losing an eye).” While Laena and Deamon’s daughters got punched and lost a dragon, the worst outcome was Rhaenyra’s boys. Despite winning the fight with a great attack on Aemond’s eye (great fight scene by the way) they both had their parentage publicly called into question. Almost an acknowledgment of what Jace was feeling. This loosened their hold on the throne that was destined to eventually be theirs and brought even more public shame to their bloodline. A close second to Aegon, who got in trouble without doing anything because he was passed out from being drunk, and he lost his status as the only one with a dragon in the immediate family. He can’t pick on his little brother anymore, because Aemond has a BFD. (Aegon needs to counter with a BFP….we need more pigs in this show.)
Kent: It has to be Baela for me. Did you see that punch that she took? It was the Westerosi version of a Tyson blow to the dome, thank you Bloodhound Gang. She took that punch and her or her sister lost out on that big ass dragon. Who else lost more? Also, we learned a valuable lesson. Don’t bring a rock to a knife fight.
2. Who looks worse in the eyes of the realm after Alicent cut Rhaenyra: Alicent, Rhaenyra, or Viserys?
Chris: Agree with Jim, Viserys got fucked by the two women in his life this episode. Not a good place to be with his health as bad as it is
Jim: Viserys got the worst of the outcome because it demonstrated once again that he doesn’t have control over either the family or the realm. His threat of tongue dismemberment seemed laughable because everyone knows he wouldn’t do it after he watched his wife slash his daughter. He just came across as even more feeble and inept than ever before. A second place in the ranking was Rhaenyra, as it once again became even more public knowledge about her boys, but not worse off than Viserys. Alicent seemed to come out stronger, and as Otto said, will easily win back Viserys’ favor over time (as much as he has left anyway, as his clock is ticking down).
Kent: I guess the answer to this question depends on one thing for me. Does the realm still view Viserys as competent with his mental faculties or do they see the spiral? I don’t think that we have a way of knowing. If I’m a member of the realm, this is how I see it. Alicent’s son gets maimed by the Princess’ bastard child. She deserved vengeance! Princess has 3 bastard children and has lost her fake husband and has married her uncle. Not cool Princess. Our great and wise King, wait, he had a hand, then gave him the boot, got a new hand, he died, and brought back the bad hand that he couldn’t trust, all while losing his real hand. Oh, and the girls in his life are beyond overdramatic. I feel bad for our great King. I think Rhaenyra comes off looking the worst and Vis gets some loyalty pity, and Alicent doesn’t seem so bad.
3. Did Rhaenyra and Daemon tell Laenor that they planned on “killing him” or do you think they intentionally wanted him dead and Qarl was the one to fill Leanor in?
Chris: For sure they told him, otherwise he might have killed Qarl in the fight.
Jim: While it wasn’t shown, I am sure that they worked with Laenor, because if this wasn’t his wish, they may have conspired to actually kill him to achieve what they wanted. I believe that while acknowledging their marital shortcomings, Rhaenyra did love Laenor, and would try and avoid harming him if at all possible. I don’t believe that this plan was hatched by Qarl alone, because he would have reported them to Corlys if he thought they wanted to kill Laenor, and as we saw during the funeral scene, Corlys knows about the relationship and would trust his word about a plot.
Kent: As I told Chris during the podcast, logic be damned, I want the better story. I contend with 100% certainty that Rhaenyra didn’t have intentions of telling Laenor. He gave that heartwarming speech about wanting to be a good dad. She knew that he had to go. Daemon is the wild card here. Daemon certainly doesn’t give a damn, but I think that he likes Corlys and he did love Laena. Would he be so cold as to not let Laenor in on it? That’s really debatable. In this situation, he doesn’t really require plausible deniability. Still, his death makes everything much easier, and Daemon seems like a guy who likes his shortcuts when it comes to him getting what he wants. Honestly, I don’t think Rhaenyra or Daemon had that conversation with Laenor. I think when Daemon talked to Qarl. He was just like: “Qarl, I want to play a game. Laenor needs to be dead to the people of our kingdom. You can kill him, don’t kill him, the choice is yours. Someone needs to die. Over in Pentos, you can be happy with or without him. The clock is ticking. Tick tock!” As a matter of fact, I am fairly certain that this is in a deleted scene.
I want to acknowledge something Jim said about us not seeing anything. We are starting to realize that this is becoming the antithesis of TV from the past decade. The whole “if they didn’t show a death, the character didn’t die” thing. This show is actually going out of its way to not show deaths and other events. That is fine, but I hope that they stay the course since this is the path that they went down. Of course, I like seeing the deaths, but it would be illogical to switch gears so dramatically.
4. It appears that we will have yet another time jump in the next episode. Do you anticipate more time jumps this season? Do you enjoy this technique for telling this particular story by time-jumping almost every other episode?
Chris: Should be the last one. Did we really need a snapshot of a day or two over the last 16 or 20 years that have passed in the show?
Jim: I have to say, I am starting to tire of the time jump, as it is starting to seem more and more like a lazy tool to advance the plot. If the writers were more competent, they would use the time between jumps to make it more seamless, rather than relying on us to figure out how many years have passed between episodes. I was really hoping the last time jump would have been the last, so I will hope once again that the one from the next episode ends it. (I feel like a basic bitch drinking a pumpkin spice latte when I have to ask why the episode can’t give us a date or something like “2 Years Later”.
Kent: Listen, fellas, it’s just a jump to the left of the timeline, and then maybe a step to the right. Daemon does some pelvic thrusting and we do this time jump again. I guess we’re going ahead another 10 years. I ask myself a very simple question: three years from now when I rewatch these episodes, will I enjoy this or find them grueling and tedious? I am starting to think that this will be more tedious. Yes, we will see certain characteristics or perhaps a hint of something in the future, but we will also see so many missed opportunities along the way.
This ties into what both Chris and Jim have to say. Did we need the snapshot? No, even though it was fun as hell. From a storytelling perspective, I think they could have done better, which ties into Jim’s take on the writing not always feeling competent. I like this show, I truly do, but we need consistency or we need to have time jumps every other episode as we tell all the big stories of this time frame in small snippets. They’re setting a weird precedent. I actually think a show that covers 60-80 years of Westeros history is kinda neat, especially if that is how they present it to us. Right now, I feel fans just want to settle in with some characters and let them evolve slowly. Perhaps I am wrong.
5. Okay, if you had to slice open your palm or your bottom lip, which do you choose and why? Think of short-term and long-term.
Chris: I disagree, Jim, since germ knowledge wouldn’t have been available to the Westerosi (still leeching people). You use your hands way more than your lips, especially in an era with way less technology than we have today. Just as with the lip every time you used your hand you would be re-opening the wound.
Jim: I think the palm is more appropriate, as all food was preserved with salt in the olden times, so every meal would sting significantly, and potentially depending on the depth, so would everything else when using the mouth (talking, kissing, yelling, etc..). Also, you run the potential of having a non-healing wound and having a reverse cleft lip like the kids in the commercials. No one would donate to a 1-800 number to pay for royalty’s surgery. A hand will heal and be useful, a mouth may heal, and will be almost as noticeable as Pirate Aemond’s eye. (I’m just picturing Larys or the cocky Lannister guy prank-calling a 1-800 number.)
Kent: I really thought that after reading these responses I would have a clear-cut favorite. Damn. I put myself in Daemon and Rhaenyra’s place. I’m guessing that antibacterial soap is out of the question here. If you’re Daemon, you definitely want Rhaen’s palm cut because he seems like a man who prefers a BJ to a Handy J. I don’t think wiping was a thing then, but you touch everything with your hands. How often are you putting your lips on anything? They are Targaryens, so that is a valid question. You need your hands for dragon riding. Daemon will still be actively training or practicing his swordplay I suspect. If say, I really need to use my lip or my hand as little as possible for the next week, which is easier? I think I slice my lip and hope that the scar isn’t too awful. I am happy to see how analytically we are approaching these questions. You don’t get this type of analysis anywhere else.
The “Willem Blackwood Award for Momentary Brilliance” – Better known as what our favorite moment or most absurd or unexpected moment of the show was for the week.
Chris: My choice would have to go to the children’s ability to merc the shit out of each other without ANY guards/adults being around. You have four of the most important children on the continent, and another 2 that would be considered immediately just outside of that number, wandering around without any guards or supervision. I find it hard to believe that they could get up to all the trouble that they did in this episode. They would have had their own Kingsguardians, teachers (maesters and septas), etc, that would have nothing to do but watch their ass. Shit, Rhaenyra had Criston when she was just a few years older.
(At minimum, 2-3 people know where one of those kids is at all times, I would speculate. They wouldn’t have ALL been without one adult. A better way to have explained this is some kind of big distraction that took the adult’s attention amidst the chaos. The Walking Dead got shit on by so many people because nobody kept track of young Carl in the first 2 seasons. How does this show not get the same criticism?? Double standards, my friends.)
Jim: While the moment was not ridiculous for the action or story, my moment was the impromptu wedding. For all the bemoaned utilization of time jumps in the series, Daemon and Rhaenyra hurried up and wedded while Fake Laenor’s body was still smoldering. They could have waited to make it less conspicuous. If the writers don’t have Corlys angry at how quickly they wedded, and have him suspecting foul play on their part, it will not only be ridiculous but a complaint. Close second as Otto regains Hand status without a simple acknowledgment or scene where Viserys asks him. One wonders why a Hand once dismissed was accepted back so easily and quickly. This is also both ridiculous and poor writing. He regained it back by the funeral, when he was states (provinces? Countries?) away, and got to the funeral quickly in official attire. Between time jumps and hurried explanations, there are some questionable choices by the writers that I hope are quickly remedied. I wish there was a funnier ridiculous moment, like making it rain from the last episode, but there wasn’t. I don’t want my negativity to detract from what was one of the best episodes yet, but my complaints are more about the series as a whole.
(Okay, the more I thought about this, I regret not really going more into Otto regaining the role of the Hand while on the podcast. It is beyond absurd! Obviously, Alicent would have had to plant the seed, but Vis was deeply concerned with the counsel that he was receiving, so that wouldn’t have gone anywhere……unless Vis is truly getting dementia. I am wondering if this is something that we may see more of. He called Alicent by his ex-wife’s name, Aemma. Still, I don’t think anybody on the small council liked Otto that much. It feels like the writers were like, we don’t have a convincing enough scene so let’s just make it so. THEN, to go further, the distance traveled, it really is mind-numbing. Sorry, I didn’t mean to go so in-depth here, but it is ridiculous!!)
Kent: I love all these answers. Really, the kids being without supervision and then having an Anchorman-type of brawl is super impressive. If Rhaena had brought a trident, I legitimately would have lost it. But Jim touched on something, and Chris and I discussed this during the podcast. My favorite aspect was not once, but both times that Corlys loses his shit and is like “What the fuck is happening in my Hall?” The only thing that could have made this better is if Daemon and Rhaenyra had their wedding in the Hall. Why not? The writers certainly seem to not care about logic. Corlys and Rhaenys are probably going to remain loyal to Daem and Rhaen for political purposes, and their granddaughters. In some sick twisted way, I can see Rhaenys approving it behind Corlys’ back. Corlys is killing it, but I fear for his well-being moving forward. A close second is Larys eyeball fucking Alicent at and after the funeral. Larys, you forget yourself!